Manhattan Loft Guy

Aug. 6, 2008 - 9 Murray Street #8W closes at just over $1,000/month / neighbor does faster (is higher better??)

yes, per month

It is not often that I can talk about a Manhattan loft sale in terms of dollars per month, but this one is just too good to pass up. The bonus angle is that a next door neighbor had a very different experience, closing a week earlier, permitting some fun analysis about who might be happier.

9 Murray Street #8W (StreetEasy link is here ) closed after 2.5 years, starting in January 2006 and ending with a deed filed (that is now visible in city records) on June 26. It was being actively marketed for all but about ten weeks over that long run around the turn of this past year, with six different prices (one of which repeated). At 30 months from start to finish and the clearing price of $3.1mm, that comes out to $1,033/month.

More conventionally, this "2,700 sq ft" condo loft traded at $1,148/ft -- a far cry from where they started in January 2006, $3.9mm. in between, they were at $3.75mm for ten months, $3.595mm for one month, $3.5mm for four months, $3.35mm for six months, then that ten week hiatus, and $3.25mm for one month before bouncing back to $3.35mm for the final two months before finding a contract that closed.

confusing name, no?
The Franklin Building is a 5 minute walk from Franklin Street, oddly enough, just off City Hall Park. The building was converted to condos about eight years ago by Alchemy (just before September 11, 2001).

no detail overlooked
The layout is classic Long-and-Narrow, with plumbing on both long sides in the middle and the significant bonus of 7 windows along one long side and 3 in a corner of the other long side. So there are 3 real bedrooms, plus an open den that can easily be closed. The condition is said to be of the no-detail-untouched level, with the "highest level" of materials and a Poggenpohl kitchen.

jealous of the neighbor?
During that ten week hiatus for #8W around the turn of the year, one of the immediate neighbors (#8SE) came to market, with a much quicker happy ending. This "2,800 sq ft" loft is of the every-inch-newly-renovated variety and was viewed by The Market as much more appealing than its neighbor. They started in January at $3.875mm, found a buyer with a contract by March and closed at $3.775mm with a deed filed on June 19, a week before the #8W deed was filed. That's about $1,350/ft, a full $200/ft higher than the long-suffering owner of #8W.

why the disparity?
#8SE has an "L" footprint, permitting the master suite to be at the opposite wing of the loft than the other 2 bedrooms. While the text of the two listings suggest they are of a similar level of finishes, it is hard to judge that from the pictures (particularly as there are relatively few for #8W). The pix for #8SE leave no doubt, however, that this is the "meticulous" renovation that is claimed. I have to believe that The Market reacted to a finishes gap between the two listings -- the "magnificent custom mill work" and the "state of the art" custom audio system are very likely emblematic of that gap.

My guess is that the no-detail-untouched finishes of #8W are the original (8 year old) finishes, which compared poorly to the "newly renovated" condition of #8SE. Certainly, anyone who saw one during the 2 months or so that they overlapped on the market also saw the other. The tortured history of one, compared to the quick success of the other tells the recent story in broad strokes. Some details from earlier history suggest that the #8W seller did not do too badly at all, after all.

who made out?
The #8SE June 2008 seller was a buyer in November 2005 at $2.8mm -- long enough ago that the "newly renovated" work was done after this November 2005 purchase. If the renovation cost only $200/ft (see the comments to my December 10, 2007 need renovation stories / a reader writes for help for the basis for using that ballpark figure), the cost-plus-renovation for #8SE comes to about $3.36mm -- sharply reducing the apparent again on the 'high' price in June of $3.775mm. (I wonder how the November 2005 sale of #8SE at $2.8mm figured into the decision to sell #8W asking $3.9mm two months later.)

In contrast, the #8W June seller was an original buyer in November 2000. I don't see a sales price, but the original mortgage on the unit was $618,750. (The original #8SE owner had a mortgage of $712k in December 2000.) If I am right in inferring that #8W was just sold without a substantial renovation from its original 2000 condition, the fact that they sold for 'only' $3.1mm in June compared to #8SE at $3.775mm probably did not make them very unhappy. They may have been anxiousvarious times in the two and a half years #8W took to sell, but they should not be unhappy. Not a bad 'investment'.

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Aug. 5, 2008 - Manhattan loft inventory as of August 4

Number of Manhattan lofts offered for sale as of ~~Sunday night~~ Monday:

price range	# of lofts
$500k to $999k	97
$1mm to $1.99mm	224
$2mm to $2.99mm	161
$3mm to $3.99mm	87
$4mm to $4.99mm	47
$5mm to $10mm	76
TOTAL	692

This total is a 2% drop from last week, which had been my two month low since I started counting (my first count on May 19 was 745; last week and three weeks ago was 707; this week's total is off 7% from my May 19 baseline). See my May 19 post for what I am counting, and why it is difficult.

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Aug. 4, 2008 - new Manhattan loft listings + closed sales in last 7 days

This is my fortieth report on the number, price distribution and neighborhood distribution for Manhattan lofts reported as new to the market or as closed sales in the last 7 days.

blame the family
The stats as of ~~Sunday night~~ Monday (spent the weekend visiting Our Youngest in Miami Beach; though a well-employed "business consultant", her internet "doesn't work" in her apartment !?!?):

there were 22 Manhattan lofts reported as new to the market in the last 7 days and 31 as sold (another unusual week, with more sales than new listings [the second in a row], though this week 12 sales were in a single new development)
half of the 22 new ones are offered below $2mm and half above $2mm, while 25 of the 31 closed sales were below $3mm

only 3 of the 22 new loft listings are in new development, while 14 of the 31 closed sales were in new development (12 at be@William)

By price	New = 22	Sold = 31
$500k to $999k	2	9
$1mm to $1.99mm	9	7
$2mm to $2.99mm	3	9
$3mm to $3.99mm	5
$4mm to $4.99mm	1	5
$5mm+	2	1

By neighborhood	New = 22	Sold = 31
Battery Park City
Chelsea	5	2
Clinton
East Village	1	2
Financial District	4	13
Flatiron	1	2
Gramercy
Greenwich Village	2	2
Kips Bay	1
Little Italy
Lower East Side	2
Murray Hill
Midtown East
Midtown West
SoHo		4
Tribeca	4	6
Turtle Bay	2
Upper East Side
Upper West Side
West Village

New loft listings in new developments

25 Broad Street (The Exchange)	1
250 East 49 Street	2

Sold lofts in new developments

90 William Street (be@William)	12
101 Warren Street	1
25 Murray Street (Tribeca Space)	1

For information about how I get this stuff and why I slice it as I do, see methodology for New + Sold in The Last Seven Days. For my most recent rant about how soft this data may be, see loft or not? caution: active ranting ahead.

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Jul. 31, 2008 - lux diversion / Time Warner or 165 Charles as better "investment"?

not much gain for Portman
Braden Keil's Gimme Shelter grab bag in today's NY Post (hat tip to Curbed for pointing it out) mentions two celebrity Manhattan real estate transactions that caught me eye, though neither involves a real loft. The first 'news' is that Natalie Portman is selling her "convertible three bedroom, three bath apartment" (with "2,500 sq ft") at 165 Charles Street on the market for $6.55mm, but what startled me is that she reportedly paid $5.7mm in 2005. Assuming (big assumption) that she gets full ask now, her net-net gain calculation starts at $850k -- before melting away. Her transaction costs on that sale will be (in round numbers and at a minimum) 5% broker commission (they are offering 2.5% to a buyer agent) and transfer fees to NYC and NYS of 1.825%, or nearly $450k. Assuming she paid transfer taxes on her way in in 2005, that's another 1.825% on that $5.7mm purchase, or another $100k.

So, $550k of her $850k 'gain' is eaten up by round number big ticket transaction costs, whether she paid cash or secured a mortgage and assuming she gets 100% of her asking price on the way out. At least she won't have to worry too much about capital gains taxes....

Costas does well
The contrast to Bob Costas experience at the Time Warner Center (reported in the same column) is remarkable. Costas has already closed on his sale of a 61st floor 3-bedroom for $8.5mm. Like Portman, he bought his unit in 2005, but he paid 'only' $4.95mm, so his net-net gain calculation starts at $3.55mm (four times Portman's if she can sell at 100% of ask) and doesn't melt away much. He will be pleased to pay his significant capital gains, I am sure.

representative values?
I have no idea if these two transactions (actually, one transaction and one marketing effort) are representative of values in their respective buildings. But the 3-year-appreciation contrast is stark: less than a 15% gain for the Stars Wars gal if she gets her ask at 165 Charles Street, vs. 70% for the Sports Guy at the Time Warner Center.

Not that you should look at your home as an investment or anything....

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Jul. 30, 2008 - pretty negotiable as 17 White Street #3A closes

an 8% solution
The Manhattan loft #3A at 17 White Street came to market on March 13 at $4.5mm and found a contract within about six weeks -- the kind of trajectory that often implies a deal at or close to the asking price. It showed up as Sold & Closed on the inter-firm data base in mid-July, while the clearing price was revealed in a NY Post Just Sold feature on July 3:

TRIBECA $4,150,000

17 White St.

Four-bedroom, three-bath co-op, 3,000 square feet, with 14-foot beamed ceilings, cast-iron pillars, oak floors, modern kitchen with separate pantry, laundry room, walk-in closets, 12 oversized double-pane windows, N/S/E exposures and keyed elevator. Maintenance $1,278, 50 percent tax-deductible. Asking price $4,500,000, on market four weeks. Brokers: David Friedman, Vertex Realty Group, Jeff Roth, Citi Habitats and Richard Ornstein, Halstead Property

(The agents reported to the Post "four weeks" but reported to the data base a contract signed as of May 1, hence my "about six weeks". Allowing for the typical week or so between accepted offer and contract signing, that is still a pretty quick deal. And that's Richard Orenstein of Halstead, not "Ornstein", who must apparently represented the buyers.)

getting what you want
Interesting to me that the sellers negotiated quickly to a $350,000 reduction from their asking price, as that result indicates that the buyers started at something around a 10% haircut, or more. Clearly, sellers were "negotiable" from Day One. Props to Jeffrey Roth of Citi-Habitats for representing the sellers through this and (evidently) getting them what they wanted relatively quickly.

funny little block
This building is on the last western block of White Street, just west of the wide intersection where Church Street and Sixth Avenue fork -- an intersection thatalways seemed to me to be a major boundary separating this block form the rest of White Street. With White Street ending in a T intersection with West Broadway just to the west, this is one tricky location to direct a stubborn cab driver to. Then again, there's not much incidental through-traffic here.

architecturally designed
The listing description says the loft is "architecturally designed" -- which it may be, but I don't read the listing photos as making that case. (Perhaps the devil is in the details that don't show up so well in the photos.) No question that the "3,000 sq ft" Long-and-Narrow footprint is terrific. Windows on 3 sides, including 5 on one long side. There's plumbing on both long sides (kitchen on the east wall, both bathrooms opposite), and just those seven columns running down the middle of the length to work around.

If I am reading the floor plan and photos correctly, the master suite is in the middle of the long west wall -- without a window. One of the other 3 bedrooms (the one next the master) also lacks a window. But assuming that the bedroom with the multi-colored panels is one of the bedrooms on the south wall, there does not seem to be much light coming from the south, so maybe that accounts for theplacement of the master suite in the architectural design.

At more than $1,300/ft, this is a pretty healthy price in a no-amenities coop -- though the low maintenance certainly makes the cost-of-carry more reasonable.

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Jul. 29, 2008 - Manhattan loft inventory as of July 27

Number of Manhattan lofts offered for sale as of Sunday night:

price range	# of lofts
$500k to $999k	99
$1mm to $1.99mm	228
$2mm to $2.99mm	165
$3mm to $3.99mm	90
$4mm to $4.99mm	47
$5mm to $10mm	78
TOTAL	707

This total is equal to the low since I started counting two months ago (my first count on May 19 was 745; two weeks ago was also 707). See my May 19 post for what I am counting, and why it is difficult.

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Jul. 28, 2008 - new Manhattan loft listings + closed sales in last 7 days

This is my thirty-ninth report on the number, price distribution and neighborhood distribution for Manhattan lofts reported as new to the market or as closed sales in the last 7 days.

The stats as of Sunday night:

there were 21 Manhattan lofts reported as new to the market in the last 7 days and 31 as sold (an unusual week, with more sales than new listings, though 20 sales were in a single new development)
13 of the 21 new ones are offered below $2mm, while 26 of the 31 closed sales were below $2mm

9 of the 21 new loft listings are in new development, while 24 of the 31 closed sales were in new development (20 at be@William)

By price	New = 21	Sold = 31
$500k to $999k	5	13
$1mm to $1.99mm	8	13
$2mm to $2.99mm	4	4
$3mm to $3.99mm	2
$4mm to $4.99mm
$5mm+	2	1

By neighborhood	New = 21	Sold = 31
Battery Park City
Chelsea	1	1
Clinton
East Village		1
Financial District	4	21
Flatiron	2	1
Gramercy		1
Greenwich Village	3	2
Kips Bay
Little Italy
Lower East Side	2
Murray Hill
Midtown East
Midtown West	1
SoHo
Tribeca	1	4
Turtle Bay	4
Upper East Side
Upper West Side	2
West Village	1

New loft listings in new developments

45 John Street	1
60 Ann Street	1
25 Broad Street (The Exchange)	1
173 MacDougal Street	1
137 Duane Street	1
315 East 46 Street (Alexander Plaza)	4

Sold lofts in new developments

90 William Street (be@William)	20
209 East 2 Street	1
1 York Street	1
475 Greenwich Street (Zinc)	2

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Jul. 21, 2008 - Manhattan loft inventory as of July 20

Number of Manhattan lofts offered for sale as of Sunday night:

price range	# of lofts
$500k to $999k	101
$1mm to $1.99mm	228
$2mm to $2.99mm	170
$3mm to $3.99mm	91
$4mm to $4.99mm	46
$5mm to $10mm	80
TOTAL	716

This total is up moderately from the last two weeks (my first count on May 19 was 745; last week was 707). See my May 19 post for what I am counting, and why it is difficult.

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Jul. 20, 2008 - new Manhattan loft listings + closed sales in last 7 days

This is my thirty-eighth report on the number, price distribution and neighborhood distribution for Manhattan lofts reported as new to the market or as closed sales in the last 7 days.

The stats as of Sunday night:

there were 35 Manhattan lofts reported as new to the market in the last 7 days and 21 as sold
23 of the 35 new ones are offered between $1mm and $3mm, while 11 of the 21 closed sales were between $1mm and $3mm

12 of the 35 new loft listings are in new development, while 6 of the 21 closed sales were in new development

By price	New = 35	Sold = 21
$500k to $999k	3	4
$1mm to $1.99mm	11	6
$2mm to $2.99mm	12	5
$3mm to $3.99mm	5	4
$4mm to $4.99mm	1	2
$5mm+	3

By neighborhood	New = 35	Sold = 21
Battery Park City
Chelsea	5	2
Clinton
East Village	2
Financial District	6	3
Flatiron	4